joe.to forums

I still look at my keyboard and I still only use 4 fingers in total. I barely ever type whole texts anyways.

Nipper, continuing on the remark you made on the Steam forums about Moria's only problem being that the AI Dir would sometimes spawn a second Tank which would indeed make the map a bit too hard, perhaps the second point mentioned in that thread you posted a link to can provide a solution to that.
Seems like you have some control on Tank and Witch frequency in the missions file. I don't know how far you can take this and how exactly you type it out in the missions file, but it might be worth I look into it.

That shit about being able to control waves also means you can from now on make the type of crescendos where the horde won't stop coming until you activate another switch that shuts the event down so to speak. Not that I wish to implement this in the Ruins, but it gives me ideas for another project I have in mind

Are you planning to leave the panic event in the big hall of Moria for Versus now that you can control the amount of waves?
I also think you should make it so the infected can climb up the tall pillars. People seem to really like having high damage pounce spots.

I have a plan for big changes to moria. I think I might be able to get rid of all the scripted common zombies. If I take out the rock-car-alarm on the stairs and the panic event in the great hall.

I think I know what you'll do, but I'll just shut up and wait

However, I see you can change certain map-specific settings about Tank & Witch probability. I'll PM you the settings I'd like to have added to the mission file for the Ruins on Versus once Co-Op is released as a Final. For example, I want to make sure a Tank always spawns, but I want to make sure it doesn't spawn right at start.

People seem to be really anxious to play our campaign in Versus though. I get a lot of remarks of people saying it would be loads of fun, I get some emails too and when I play versus games against randoms, people recognize my name in game and ask me "will you guys make it versus?".
We really need to make work of this and find some people we trust to playtest it on versus thoroughfully. It needs to be really polished.

whats versus?

I did a quick test of the two new things I implemented. Problem is I have to redo the navs to see what the events will be like fully which is a pain in the ass. Haunts should be cool but moria might not work too well.

With haunts I got rid of all the scripted zombies and now have a one-wave panic event in the stretch room and a 2-wave panic event in the graveyard. I think I'm going to force the players though the stretch room too. If I can get it to work without breaking the nav and I can get the bots to go inside reliably. I used a timed button with a really high timer (4 min) to move the doombuggy now. So someone has to hold the button down to get it to smash through both fences and you don't have to finish the sequence. So the doombuggy is only moving when someone is standing at the control panel. Problem is the button doesn't display a message because the timer is so high I doubt players will figure out that they need to hold it down.

Same thing with the book in moria. It works but there's no feedback that it is so players will likely never figure it out. Plus the sound doesn't stop when they let go so gandolf keeps talking even though the player is no longer "reading" the book.

if anyone is curious about nipper's mapping process, i highly recommend his blog and twitter feed

forgot to post my twitter here: https://twitter.com/ccnipper

I'll try to update this at least once a day.

There is just one problem with the stretch room: if the AI director decides to spawn a normal horde when the players are watching the stretch room sequence, the horde will spawn in those rooms behind the walls, and you'll hear them trying to get to you but they're stuck either by the ceiling that isn't high enough, or, if you made the walls unbreakable, stuck because of the walls.
You *could* mark is NO MOBS but I'm afraid that when you have the crescendo there, they won't appear where you want them to.

As for how the players will figure out how to "hold" the book and the doombuggy's switch, perhaps I can make a custom sprite (an attention grabber) with the text "Hold to activate" or something and have it killed once they use the book/switch?

I just had the chance to play this for the first time.
Fuck you guys did good lol.

On moria i dont see any problems with a 2nd tank as long as you supply some healthpacks that allways show up. In any valve map that can happen also and its never a problem there (death toll stage 5 can have 5 tanks! - 2 before the finale, and 3 in the finale where 1 is while you run to the boat)

The first and second map were both fine to me. The ammount of items there was perfect. However, at the cart in haunts it often takes some time to figure out you need to press it twice. Why dont you simply place a button further up the road to make it continue? That crecendo is one that you cant rush through anyway (at least, not on expert)

On moria a minigun would be welcome so you can battle the horde and slow the tank down just a little bit. On expert its simply impossible to beat the tank with just T1 weapons and without molos or pipes. I havent played the rest of that stage in beta 2 yet though but if its quite similar to last time its fine (i did spot weapons being just after that tank/horde crecendo at least - thats a good thing - however, make that place uncampable by allowing a horde to drop above the weapons). Also, note that we managed to finish it once because the tank bugged and didnt show. At least the wall does open as workarround which is a good thing.

For stage 4 and 5 i cant judge yet as we havent reached them on expert yet (just found the updated campaign today).

a few issues are all that remain before the next release:

map 1
- in the blockade area if you go above a certain height the rain stops. no idea why

map 2
- its possible to get to the 2nd panic event (graveyard) before the director cooldown is over (90 seconds?) this wouldn't be an issue if...
- its not spawning enough zombies. no idea why. only spawns like 2 or 3 specials for the entire map

map 3
- holy shit it works perfectly I can't believe it. Only thing is the progress bar shows the new book button being done after 5 seconds even though you have to hold it down like 17 seconds. But I got the gandolf audio to stop so hopefully people will figure it out easily. Oh who am I kidding nobody will figure it out but its the only way I can fix the tank-dodge exploit.

map 5
- The camera ending showing the spawn saferoom instead of the hospital bed


Boo in your map did you make the panic event one-wave? I think 2 would be better. love the traps by the way

If you played the map by itself by not making it the 4th map of the campaign, but just as a stand alone BSP (and loading it through the 'map' command) it will only spawn one wave because the game 'thinks' it's the first map of a campaign. First and second maps never have more than one wave in crescendos.
You also won't get any tanks nor witches if you load it that way.

However, once you vpk it, the game will 'see' it's the 4th map and spawn two waves and the SpawnBossThreat thing should make sure there is always at least one Tank too.
Unless of course, Crash Course changed the crescendos in such a way that the AI dir will always spawn one wave by default unless you state otherwise.

As for your maps:
map1: eh I have no idea. But at what point do you get that high on the map anyways? I can't remember having ever seen this happen. Believe it or not, but I had a dream about Night Terror a week ago: I pictured the beginning of this map similar to the ending of The Wake but instead of running towards that whacky bedroom, you actually walk away from it "into" the world of 28 days later. It was just a dream (or 'night terror' LOLOLOLOL I'm so fucking funneh) though. It's your map, you decide

map2: so you got 2 crescendo events? The cooldown should be 90sec and yes, it has been known to mess with the AI dir if you activate another crescendo within those 90 seconds

map3: Good to hear! Seeing some people failed to understand that you have to use the fucking alarm clock even AFTER you made it obvious on beta2 it's unprobable that people will figure out this one... maybe add a sprite that tells people to hold it till the audio is done or something and kill the sprite afterwards? Or do something similar to the final part of Moria (the "fly you fools" grafitty) that would in this case just say "read the book for 17 seconds". I do suggest you do something to make it clear though or we'll get more stupid complaints of people saying "OMG MAKE IT MOAR OBVIUS WHAT U HAV TO DO ZOMG"

map5: I have never had this happen to me... it's really strange because the nav is correct and is unrelated to the fact that you simply teleport the survivors to a certain position...

I already did that!

Probably throw some more junk in there. This should stop people from being attacked during the ForceSurvivorPositions and tie the whole campaign together better.

The rain stopping is noticeable as you walk up the little hill to the shack or if you stand on top of the truck.


One wave at the end of the stretch room sequence, which is now the only way through.
Two waves at the graveyard(might make it three). If people look around and search they won't make it there in less than 90 seconds but if you speedrun it could be possible.

so I added the detour to haunts, made the map a little longer and it should be impossible to break the 2nd panic event by getting there in less than 90 seconds. Plus now our campaign has the one thing it was missing: an upside down room.

I forgot that the director sorta clears the map of infected after a crescendo. What a jerk.

There isn't anything major left to do with any of my maps before the next release. Just a bunch of small details and I wanted to tweak the item spawning. The goal is this weekend for the next (final?) coop release.