Gay rights

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Overbear
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Gay rights

Post by Overbear » Thu Apr 23, 2009 10:37 am

Ok this topic was spawned due to a offtopic thread in another part of the fourm.
Cervantes wrote:comparing gay rights to civil rights is pretty offensive to blacks tbh
also did you really compare black power to saying "queer"
like, firebombing honkys is on the same level as using an out-dated word for "gay"

yeah i don't care anymore but if you post in mature discussion i'll explain how comparing the civil rights movement to gay rights is an insult to the struggles of the black race
Cervantes: Not only is the struggle for rights among gays comparable, but dates farther back than the black civil rights movement.

1)we gays are hated by all other races, not because of the color of our skin, but simply because of who we love and sleep with.
2)We gays were slaughtered wholesale during the Holocaust. We were rounded up, and put to death...not worked to death like the jews, outright put down as a "threat" to Nazi Germany. I will try to find the stats, but it was something like only 1 in 80 gays sent to camps lived.
3)Even during the civil rights moment, blacks had the right to get married, to walk down the street holding hands, to exist without the threat of death for daring to love. Every day in this country a GLBT is beat to death, they die not in dignity, but in some alleyway, alone, in pain, all because they were "different"

So you can try as you want to explain how its a "insult" but its not, we fight every day not for just basic rights, but our very lives.
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms . . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man - Thomas Jefferson

Armed gays don't get bashed - http://www.pinkpistols.org

YES I made an account here, you can all quit bitching at me in game now.
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Rat-morningstar
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Rat-morningstar » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:00 am

eah, some people are plain dicks.

anyway, if i remember corectly, blacks have been opressed longer that gays, they were accepted in ancient greece and so forth but lacks were hunted like game by the arabian world.

anyway, everyones being too extreme imo, "awesome" being a perm ban offence.
if you don't mind answering, do you feel offended if someone calls something queer?
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Re: Gay rights

Post by sys » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:14 am

BEING GAY IS A CHOICE OBVIOUSLY
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Dr.Boo
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Dr.Boo » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:18 am

I don't understand why people make such a big problem out of gays. They like the same sex, so what? it's their right. It's not like they harm anyone and what happens in someone's sex life is none of my business nor does it interest me.
I will never have a problem with gays as long as they follow the rules that apply to heteros too: keep hands off children, sex is something you do in private and not in public, you don't dress as a fucking whore unless you want to be called that way, you keep your making out sessions within certain limits and you don't rape.

Yet I have seen more hetero's breaking these rules than gays to be honest.
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Sizzler » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:22 am

There's lots of places in the world where the punishment for homosexuality is death. It's terrible in comparison to a civil rights struggle that was pretty much USA-exclusive and brought on because Americans have and will always be bigoted shitheads

And then there's the whole Army controversy, essentially homosexuals are banned from the US military, it's completely absurd and blatantly intolerant

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Re: Gay rights

Post by Overbear » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:08 pm

Rat-morningstar wrote:if you don't mind answering, do you feel offended if someone calls something queer?
Absolutely, I cringe every time I hear someone go "thats gay" or "dude don't be gay". Would you like it if I walked around going "ewwww dude don't do that, its so hetro" well perhaps thats a bit silly but I think you get the point I am trying to make here.

Look most here know I am not Mr. Sensitive, hell I can stand my own and fight my own battles, but...it does get tiresome to hear "gay this" and "awesome that" all the time.
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms . . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man - Thomas Jefferson

Armed gays don't get bashed - http://www.pinkpistols.org

YES I made an account here, you can all quit bitching at me in game now.
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Overbear » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:09 pm

Dr.Boo wrote:I don't understand why people make such a big problem out of gays. They like the same sex, so what? it's their right. It's not like they harm anyone and what happens in someone's sex life is none of my business nor does it interest me.
I will never have a problem with gays as long as they follow the rules that apply to heteros too: keep hands off children, sex is something you do in private and not in public, you don't dress as a fucking whore unless you want to be called that way, you keep your making out sessions within certain limits and you don't rape.

Yet I have seen more hetero's breaking these rules than gays to be honest.
Trust me man, most gays do not go for the whole gay pride nightmare. I don't even go to pride parades anymore, because they are a zoo, and make us look very bad.
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms . . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man - Thomas Jefferson

Armed gays don't get bashed - http://www.pinkpistols.org

YES I made an account here, you can all quit bitching at me in game now.
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Chief Cheese » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:13 pm

I have no problem whatsoever with homosexuals. However, I'm taking the words queer and gay back. A queer person is odd and a gay person is merry. I want to skip gaily along, no matter the queer looks I get.

And there's nothing funnier then telling a homophobe thar science says he's gay.
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Cc_Hairy » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:46 pm

Chief Cheese wrote:I have no problem whatsoever with homosexuals. However, I'm taking the words queer and gay back. A queer person is odd and a gay person is merry. I want to skip gaily along, no matter the queer looks I get.

And there's nothing funnier then telling a homophobe thar science says he's gay.
chez ftw

but we need something equally short to replace it then - homosexual is too damn long

If being HS has all those things and more pushing against it and the odds of having a genetic offspring are less as a result then why isn't HS natural selected against? Perhaps because it is naturally selected for. We just haven't found what the thing being selected for is yet. As a coarse analogy think of the recessive gene for SS anemia protecting against malaria or the recessive gene for cystic fibrosis protecting against TB. What survival characteristic do non HS people have in families that have more HS's in them (besides not having to pay for interior decorators etc.)?
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Bandit_8[ » Thu Apr 23, 2009 12:52 pm

I don't think any group that has ever struggled to be accepted wishes to be compared to any other group, past, or present.

Jews have had a bad time in history. So have Africans, the world over, not just in the USA. Disabled persons, the blind, people that are smaller in stature, people with disfigurements.

I think the point they can all agree on, is to not be unaccepting of people who are the way they are not due to choice.

I didn't choose to be a white man. I don't consciously choose to be attracted to the opposite sex. I don't choose to have the desire to eat sugary foods, my body is craving it, because my blood sugar is low.

The argument comes from those who believe that some things in life are a choice. With that idea in their heads, they can bash others without feeling guilty.

I do find myself cringing when I hear someone say that something is 'gay'. But to try to put a positive spin on it, which is very very difficult, at least the idea of being gay, or something being gay is almost more acceptable now than it was 40 years ago. If someone called someone 'gay' back then, even in jest, the 'victim' of the insult might have been stoned to death, or lynched, in some places. Now it is not so much a slur as we think it should be, but rather a commentary.

I know it is impossible to defend it, but I am trying to look at it rationally, rather than emotionally. For years, african-americans have felt it is okay to call each other the N-word, but it is not to be used by anyone else. It is a double standard.

You want to hear something that I'd bet not one of you reading this could possibly understand?

"You're Mom!"

When I hear that, I could easily be quite offended. My mother is dying, and elderly, and sacrificed a lot for me. Soon I will be missing her, and hearing that 'joke' as a funny, well, is not too funny to me. But no one that uses it around me could possibly know that I am upset, if not offended by it. It is funny, I can see both the humor in it, as well as the hurt. I even use it myself sometimes, (Especially with my son, who's Mom is a complete betch)

Not all Africans are N*&ge#'s, not all homosexuals are 'F.a.6.5', in fact,

we are all individual beautiful snowflakes.

Part of the scene from the film Full Metal Jacket that spawned some discussion on this board recently included R. Lee Ermy's Character saying a string of offensive slurs, in which he is saying he hates all of them equally, and that they are not what other people call them. You are not what I think of you, or the name I call you, you are who you choose to be. It is part of the military breaking you down in order to build you back up.
"Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of killing unwanted babies, it's just that the idea of letting women make a decision doesn't sit well with me." - Zach Braff on abortion.
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Overbear
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Overbear » Thu Apr 23, 2009 1:15 pm

oddly man, the scene from FMJ doesn't bother me one bit. I love R. Lee Ermy, he even played a very cool gay guy (even kissed another guy) in a movie.

Its when people try to tell me "Oh you arn't oppressed, you don't know what true struggle for rights is" that I get hot under the collar.
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms . . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man - Thomas Jefferson

Armed gays don't get bashed - http://www.pinkpistols.org

YES I made an account here, you can all quit bitching at me in game now.
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Re: Gay rights

Post by joe » Thu Apr 23, 2009 5:38 pm

about 10 years ago when gay started to become the catch-all insult that it is today it bothered me a lot. today it's still annoying but fortunately seems to be fading away. or maybe i just don't hear it as much because i stopped playing counter-strike and i don't have an xbox. i've even used it that way once or twice when i wasn't thinking, although i immediately regretted it.

i used to ban people on the CS server or at least kick them just for saying gay but it's so common now it's almost impossible to punish for it. but i look forward to the day when people stop using it that way.

as far as comparing the struggles between minority groups, it's meaningless to say one was worse than the other or the comparison is an insulting. human rights are human rights and as MLK said (or maybe it was someone else) if ANYONE in the world is in chains then i am not free either, and i feel that is 100% true. anyone with any decency should be outraged at the many problems the US has, including the racism against blacks and bigotry against gays. it's all part of the same fight, as far as i'm concerned.
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Cervantes » Thu Apr 23, 2009 5:40 pm

response to 1: you aren't hated by all other races?? idgi
response to 2: so were jews and political dissidents and communists and to be honest i feel more sorry for the jews than the homosexuals. at least you can hide your homosexuality and yes in that situation you should hide your homosexuality because in such an oppressive totalitarian regime social change is going to be put down violently
response to 3. there are more hate crimes against muslims, jews, etc than gays

the difference is that the gay rights movement today has only one strong opponent and that's the conservative right/church groups, and as the US approaches the European post-church mentality that's liable to be wiped straight out
also the whole "we struggle for our life everyday" is bullshit
complete bullshit

black people to this day are discriminated against whether it be a clear hatred or a subconscious distrust of them due to the fact that a lot more black people are poor. they were ejected from 200 years of white oppression into a society which distrusted them, suffered a few more decades of being second-class citizens before they got the right to be fully accepted into society, and to this day they're still poor because it would be racist to help them (reverse racismmm). drugs and gangs are pervasive among poor inner-city blacks as ways of life because the normal society we lean on has shunned them for being so poor. everyday is literally a struggle for life for them because who knows a rival gang might shoot them in a drive-by.

do i support the gay rights movement? yes; gay people are people just like everyone else and they should have rights just like everyone else. but don't think for a second your struggles are comparable to that of black people

not included in this post: the history of american racial superiority interwoven into our social fabric unlike homophobia which stayed in the realm of religion and as religion weakened as did homophobia
:)
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Overbear » Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:43 pm

Cervantes wrote:response to 1: you aren't hated by all other races?? idgi
response to 2: so were jews and political dissidents and communists and to be honest i feel more sorry for the jews than the homosexuals. at least you can hide your homosexuality and yes in that situation you should hide your homosexuality because in such an oppressive totalitarian regime social change is going to be put down violently
response to 3. there are more hate crimes against muslims, jews, etc than gays

the difference is that the gay rights movement today has only one strong opponent and that's the conservative right/church groups, and as the US approaches the European post-church mentality that's liable to be wiped straight out
also the whole "we struggle for our life everyday" is bullshit
complete bullshit

black people to this day are discriminated against whether it be a clear hatred or a subconscious distrust of them due to the fact that a lot more black people are poor. they were ejected from 200 years of white oppression into a society which distrusted them, suffered a few more decades of being second-class citizens before they got the right to be fully accepted into society, and to this day they're still poor because it would be racist to help them (reverse racismmm). drugs and gangs are pervasive among poor inner-city blacks as ways of life because the normal society we lean on has shunned them for being so poor. everyday is literally a struggle for life for them because who knows a rival gang might shoot them in a drive-by.

do i support the gay rights movement? yes; gay people are people just like everyone else and they should have rights just like everyone else. but don't think for a second your struggles are comparable to that of black people

not included in this post: the history of american racial superiority interwoven into our social fabric unlike homophobia which stayed in the realm of religion and as religion weakened as did homophobia
You have got to be fucking kidding me...

1)if you don't get it, you need to pick up a book and quit playing computer games so much. :roll:
2)So what you are saying is, its ok that Mathew Shepard was beaten, tied to a fence and left to DIE...he was gay, hey others get and have got worse. :x

3)Come again?

http://www.awesome.com
http://gay-persons-of-color.blogspot.co ... yemen.html
http://www.miketidmus.com/blog/2009/04/ ... n-baghdad/
http://thewordwarrior.wordpress.com/200 ... d-in-iraq/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Shepard


Now look at this:
http://www.gender.org/remember/


Every day, every hour of every day, someone from the GLBT community is harassed, discriminated against, beat, or outright murdered...all for loving someone different. I hope to hell you wake up before you go thru the rest of your life with the hate blinders you have on.

*not included in this post, the thousands of hate web pages, hundreds of thousands of murders, and the thousand+ years of discrimination against GLBT people. *
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms . . . disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes . . . Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man - Thomas Jefferson

Armed gays don't get bashed - http://www.pinkpistols.org

YES I made an account here, you can all quit bitching at me in game now.
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Cervantes
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Re: Gay rights

Post by Cervantes » Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:51 pm

yes some rednecks hate gay people
they stand for everyone in america

there will always be people who do this shit and the only thing we can do is find them reprehensible
(but not to give them harsher punishments because hate crime legislature is thoughtcrime)

and why the christ are you saying i hate gay people just because i don't blow up a hate crime
you know what's worse than hate crime
dying alone on a street cold because you have no money
that's worse
:)
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